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- [Host] On this episode of "Defense News Weekly",
we literally cannot stop talking about drones.
The transformative tech
and how it has defined current warfare
and humbled armies
continues to dominate the defense industry.
Up first, we check in on Dedrone
and how they're using software
and man portable sensors to offer a range of detection,
identification, and defense options
for militaries and governments.
We also get analysis from an expert
on how artificial intelligence
has supercharged the drone revolution
and the need to adapt to armed troops with drone
and other tech faster.
Finally, a conversation on the challenge of the Arctic
and how the U.S. and European nations
need to adapt to the evolving North
as a potential battlefield.
Wrapping up our reporting trip to London
for the DSEI conference,
it's the latest in news and analysis
from the Pentagon to the platoon
here on "Defense News Weekly".
(upbeat music)
Welcome back to "Defense News Weekly".
When it comes to drone defense,
militaries and governments
are faced with a complicated problem.
How do you identify and target enemy UAVs quickly
and accurately when designs change almost by the week?
At DSEI 2025, we caught up with Dedrone
about their solutions.
Have a look.
(gentle music)
- So I'm here for "Defense News".
I'm with Mary-Lou Smulders,
who is the chief marketing officer of Dedrone,
and Dedrone is providing some of the counter UAS security
here at the DSEI UK defense show that we're at today.
Can you explain a little bit about what Dedrone is
and, yeah, how it works?
- Absolutely. And thank you for having me today.
I appreciate you guys stopping by.
Dedrone by Axon is the global leader in airspace security.
In very simple terms,
what that means is we stop the bad drones
and we enable the good drones to fly.
If you think about it, drones are just tools.
- [Rudy] Yeah, sure.
- And so when we're here at a defense show,
one of the primary focuses is indeed counter drones
or stopping the good drones,
or sorry, stopping the bad drones from flying.
So what we think about is, in different kinds of scenarios,
how do we stop those drones?
Dedrone is the most installed airspace security company
in the world.
We protect almost a thousand sites
around the world in 33 countries.
And we do that on both the public safety side,
you think more about policing like airports,
critical infrastructure, large mass gatherings,
and also on the national defense side,
the focus here at DSEI.
- Right. And that's in Ukraine and the United States.
Can you talk about something about the clients,
the military clients for Dedrone?
- Yeah, so across those 33 countries,
we work with the governments
of six of the seven G7 nations.
We do obviously work for the U.S. government.
We have been installed in Ukraine since April
when the war broke out.
And we have our Dedrone portable solution,
which I'll show you later,
but it's a simple solution,
comes in two Pelican cases,
and you have everything you need
to set it up in 15 minutes or less.
With that solution, over 200 units,
we're able to help Ukraine protect their entire front line
by networking all of those nodes together.
- [Rudy] So networking the sensors?
- Right, to give you a clear picture
of the area of interest,
in that case, the front line.
- And Dedrone works with an AI-enabled database
to recognize the drones,
whether it's a friendly drone or an enemy drone.
How do you deal with all the innovation
that's going on in Ukraine where you see a lot of, you know,
DYI, home-manufactured drones, so to say?
- Right.
So when you think about a drone incident,
there are four basic steps.
Detect the drone, you have to know it's there,
with enough time to be able to react.
Track the drone, fancy word for locate.
Where is the drone, and often, where is the pilot?
And identify what you mentioned there.
It's actually interesting.
You have to do that on two vectors.
The one is very simply friend or foe.
You don't wanna be shooting down your own drones.
The other one is, to your point, what kind of drone is it?
Because that will inform you on how you need to mitigate
that specific drone.
- And then mitigation,
is that soft kill solutions
like this jammer that we're seeing here?
Or does that also include kinetic solutions?
- At Dedrone by Axon,
we have, in our philosophy, a core solution
that is open architecture.
Just like this mitigation system
or any of the sensors,
different sensors and mitigation systems are required
for different scenarios.
(gentle music)
- Mary-Lou, you were talking
about the mobility solution for Dedrone.
Can you show us a little bit about what we're seeing here?
- Yes. We can present our solution in many different ways.
And what we're seeing with this cat-and-mouse game
is that we need more and more protection.
- [Rudy] Yeah.
- One of the solutions that we offer beyond fixed site
where you have walls and poles
that you can put the sensors on
is let's say frontline or quick deployment.
So we offer our solution in simple cases
that are man carryable,
that can be opened and set up in 15 minutes or less.
- And that basically contains all the software
that pulls together the sensors,
the AI recognition of drones?
- Yes.
It also includes the physical attributes that you need.
You have the mast, the battery power packs, the sensors,
and optional Starlink should you need that connectivity.
- And is that man portable
or would you need it on a vehicle such as this?
- These are suitcases that are man portable, ready to go.
And also, many of our clients use them.
You can load them on airplanes very easily
for VIP protection
when you are coming to a new potentially contested area.
- Can you say something
about what a Dedrone does for the cost?
- Yes, 100%.
And you're exactly right.
Let's be clear.
You have a $500 FPV drone that can fly over
and take out an $82 million fighter jet.
You will not win that war.
By definition, you will lose, right?
Similarly, in the beginning of Ukraine war,
they were launching Shaheds
that were being fought back with million dollar missiles.
Again, the price and equity will surely guarantee failure.
So you need to meet that low cost, low training challenge,
with a similar low cost
and easy learning curve defense system,
which is exactly what we've done.
So if you look at the vehicle behind me,
you see the two sensors at the top
that are offering a 360-degree view of the sky
with a simple tablet mounted inside
that tells you what kind of drone it is, where it is,
potentially where the pilot is,
and how close to or time to point of interest, which is you,
the incoming drone might be.
- So if you've got the system on a vehicle,
you're pulling together the data from various sensors,
which may have different sensitivities,
so how do you recognize all the drones
that are out there if you've got, you know,
varying quality sensors, shall we say?
- That is the best question of the day.
The core of our solution
is indeed our software command and control system, or C2.
We have tens of millions of flights already collected.
And to that, we've added synthetic data that's made of data
for different kinds of edge cases.
Like this is actually a helicopter-
- [Rudy] To train the AI recognition.
- Yes.
And what you get from that is multi-sensor fusion.
Some of our competitors will say,
"This is where the radar thinks it is.
This is where the acoustics thinks it is.
This is where the camera thinks it is.
I'll do an average dot in the middle."
We've trained the software to the point
where you are getting a true picture of the sky above you.
(gentle music)
- [Host] When we come back,
a look at protecting Arctic sovereignty
and how Europe needs to respond in a changing north.
Stay tuned.
(upbeat music)
Welcome back.
With waterways opening fast
and terrain shifting as conditions warm,
the Arctic is an evolving battlefield
for the world's major powers,
but how should Europe and the U.S. respond
politically and militarily?
We caught up with a panel at DSEI 2025 to look at the issue.
- What are your views on the Alliance of Northern Nations
to protect Arctic sovereignty?
What does that look like in terms of the border?
It's an issue to some degree being litigated back
where I come from in the United States
and increase interest, of course,
from the incumbent administration
on Greenland access to the Arctic Circle.
What does defense and readiness for Europe look like
in that theater, so to speak, of the conversation?
- We do a lot of work in that part of the world.
And I think that the state of readiness,
and I think that the capability there is exceptional.
I think that they really reacted extremely quickly.
I think that they're really driving in the right way
and they're working in a truer line.
So I think that's in a pretty good shape
if I look at that in comparison, say, other parts
of Europe maybe.
So I think it's a pretty good state.
- The balance between focusing on the Baltic
and controlling the Baltic,
and I mean the Arctic,
it used to defend itself 'cause it was ice.
And now we're in a condition
where suddenly it's potentially a highway.
- Yeah.
- And whether it would be used for commercial purposes,
and I mean commercially,
the people that were really interested in it are Chinese.
Yeah.
And whether it's necessary
that we have some dominant military power that controls it,
or whether there is some agreement that it's the high seas
and there shouldn't be, you know, anybody that's particular,
that's an open area.
I'm not qualified to speak about it,
but I do know in terms of balance of effort,
you know, that the extent
to which northern European countries think
they have to devote naval resources to the Arctic
and the extent to which they focus on the Baltic,
that's a question
that it's a policy question first for them,
and then the industrial consequences will follow.
- Can I chime in?
One thing I'd just like to bring in about the Arctic
as an operating environment,
one of the things we have to think about,
I mean, I'm going back to my hobbyhorse here
of the electromagnetic spectrum,
but fighting in the spectrum
in that part of the world can be difficult.
Because of where you are,
you start getting things like the ionosphere,
which we depend on,
the high frequency communications
starts doing very strange things.
Satellite communications, believe it or not,
is not as comprehensive as it should be
in that part of the world.
Previous years, we very much focused
to having understandably a global coverage
of, for example, for military sat call.
But one things we've done is we've often omitted the polls
because there was no real reason
to have a lot of coverage up there.
That is changing now.
The U.S., for instance, is pouring investment
into satellite communications in the Arctic.
We've got the Canadians
who are doing some interesting things.
We are looking at Over-the-Horizon Radar in the Arctic.
So to be able to see the threat
before it appears on the horizon.
But we need to be aware that the spectrum
can be a difficult resource to fight through
in that part of the world.
So we need to think about what we're gonna do about that,
whether that's a spectrum-led approach
or whether that's more conventional.
You know, I'm gonna sound very boring,
very old fashioned here.
Paper maps and compasses and grease pencils,
that kind of thing.
- As we have this robust conversation on military readiness,
a question about our political readiness,
maybe it's about political will a bit more.
Do we currently have the political will across Europe
that is prepared to respond to the threats at play?
- I mean, personally,
I think in some parts of Europe, yes.
And as we've been speaking on the panel about just now,
that there is, you know, certainly in the north of Europe,
there is a very keen awareness of the threat.
You do see more of a whole of society approach
in places like Sweden, Finland, the Baltic, et cetera.
If it goes up, we're all gonna be involved.
But I think in other parts of Europe, that's not the case.
I think in other parts of Europe
and in other parts of policies,
there is a keenness to avoid conflict.
Part of that I think is driven to an extent
by Afghan and Iraq and our experiences in those theaters.
But we mustn't count Russian disinformation,
hybrid warfare approaches that if you have, for instance,
where I live, in France, there's some very strong voices
against involvement in Ukraine.
But you have to look
at who is propelling those voices, you know,
and who is propelling those arguments.
So I think that's-
- If you don't mind me asking,
you mean who's propelling those political arguments
within the country? - Correct. Yeah.
Absolutely.
I mean, I'm not trying to say,
sort of, Russia's behind everything,
but I'm saying there are resources there
to help amplify viewpoints that may be saying,
let's have less defense spending
or whatever it might be.
And as an add on to that,
I think the challenge we face in Europe
is that in many ways you can't have more defense spending
at the expense of something else.
People understandably will still want healthcare,
education provision,
and, yeah, pensions, whatever it is.
So that's why, as you are all saying earlier on,
you have to get imaginative about how you spend the money.
You have to get collaborative.
And that's, I think, how you can sort of square that circle.
- Yeah, I mean, in the UK,
the government has sort of accepted
that the way to, if you like, popularized,
but make acceptable more defense spending
is to emphasize its economic benefits
and its economic benefits across the country,
including the less well endowed parts of the economy.
And it's pushing that.
I mean, in the UK, there is an acceptance.
It's almost where you're looking in government,
there's a readiness to spend more.
And the Ministry of Defence is pressed for that
amongst our defense ministers.
But there's a words of caution coming from the treasury
and other parts of government.
But you know, I mean, I think there is the spending
for Ukraine, for instance,
which I think is about 3 billion,
three and a half billion pounds a year,
which is a chunk of the defense budget, that's unquestioned.
Yeah. That's not debated at all.
- Yeah. I think the political will is a great question.
When you look at these arms-lengths conflicts
where you can, if you can field your capabilities
through a third party, it's quite interesting.
Committing your own resources,
I think that's something else.
And I think the political will
is not consistent across Europe.
I have a quite deep strong view about that.
But it is varied. It's very strong.
Maybe up north, there's a quite a cohesive view.
For further east you go, there's a cohesive view.
Maybe these border states, border countries,
Turkey, for example, they'll think differently
because they, you know, are right the East and the West.
I think one thing to come back to as well
is thinking of what might propel that cohesiveness
is that China is involved supporting Russia perhaps
with technologies that are eye-wateringly available.
And we must not ever lose sight of that.
- Yeah, that is one of the,
I felt with China and Russia and the Ukraine conflict,
China does not want the Russians to lose.
- Correct.
- But it does not want the Russians to win either.
And I mean, that's a judgment call
about from what you observed,
but when you think of the long-term implications,
it's a big question that-
- Yeah.
- The only thing I would like to add is,
goes back to what we were saying
right at the beginning is about the speed element.
Because I think that the longer that this goes on,
then the political will or the public support,
I think is only gonna probably deteriorate
because people get a little bit fatigued
with things going on.
Like Tom, I live in France and, you know, it's palpable.
You can see the way that that's declined.
So I think this is about industry striking pretty quickly
and really, you know, try to make the most
of the opportunity that we have.
Exactly as Trevor said, you know, I think the smart way
is to make this a benefit to the business,
to the economy and to really do it in that way.
Otherwise, I think there's gonna be some challenges.
- [Host] When we return,
our financial expert is back with tips
on when to ask for a credit limit increase.
Don't go away.
(upbeat music)
(air whooshing)
Welcome back.
If you've got your financial feet under you,
it may be time to take a step forward
with a credit limit increase.
On this edition of "Money Minute",
Jeanette Mack from Navy Federal Credit Union
returns with advice on how to time it right.
(air whooshing)
- Ever wonder if raising your credit limit is a smart move?
Well, it can be, if you're doing it for the right reasons.
A higher limit gives you more available credit
and lowers your credit utilization ratio,
or the percentage of credit you're using
compared to your overall credit limit.
And keeping that number low
can actually boost your credit score over time.
So when is the right time
to ask for a credit limit increase?
It's best to try it
when your credit has improved, your income has gone up,
or you've had your account for a while.
Lenders look at your payment history, income,
and how long you've had your card.
If you've been paying on time
and keeping balances low, you're in a good spot.
But here's the catch:
more credit means more spending power,
but it doesn't mean you should spend more.
It's easy to feel like you've got extra money to play with,
but that can lead to trouble.
If you raise your limit and start charging more,
you could end up hurting your score instead of helping it.
So be smart.
Use credit to build your financial future, not break it.
A little discipline now can lead to big rewards later.
- [Host] To get more coverage
of military and defense topics,
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When we come back more from DSEI
and the ever-evolving conversation about drones.
Stay tuned.
(upbeat music)
(air whooshing)
Welcome back to "Defense News Weekly".
With both the age of the cheap drone as a weapon
and AI both upon us,
it pays to look at how one supercharges the other,
and what it means for modern defense.
At DSEI 2025, we hosted a conversation
to look at the impact of artificial intelligence on drones
and how to stay ahead of adversaries in the cyber realm,
with a dash of analysis
on the defense industrial pipeline thrown in.
Check it out.
- Talk to me about some of the biggest shifts you have seen,
even in just the last, let's say, five to 10 years
about the way that drones are used.
- Well, I think, you know, really, AI, you know,
and I say AI, that's somewhat becoming
kind of a throwaway term, right?
There's a lot of discussion around what is defined by AI.
I know at Red Cat,
we're actually adding a lot of layers of it
in our tech stack for our drones.
It's this idea of reduction of cognitive load
for the end user.
But that's really, I see where the biggest, you know,
changes are in the industry
is this adding these layers of AI,
whether it's aided target recognition, 3D mapping,
focused on the video stream.
All of these things are now being integrated
on a regular basis,
and that's really what's trying to changing the battlefield.
I think the other thing to look at too
is what's driving what?
Is technology driving how battlefield operations
are happening, or is it the other way around?
Or is it kind of this, like, this kind of hamster wheel?
And I believe it's the hamster wheel,
you know, the evolution.
That's why I think we've seen the evolution of drones
happen so quickly
because the battlefield is extremely dynamic,
especially, again, when you look at Ukraine
where it's changing daily.
And so this idea of collecting data
to drive your innovation and your product development,
we were fortunate enough to actually have Black Widow
over in Ukraine for multiple times of testing.
And it wasn't until we actually had it there
on the front lines to really gather that daily data
to see actually how the cat-and-mouse game is happening.
You know, you tweak something on your end,
the adversary then tweak something on their end,
and it is this dance that you're doing,
but it has to be done on a constant basis.
If you're not iterating, you die.
It's that simple.
- Yeah, it reminds me
of what a lot of cybersecurity giants talk about,
which is you want the technology in the hands
of the proverbial good guys.
But, you know, the bad guys oftentimes have access
to the same underlying technology.
And in the cybersecurity realm,
a lot of their biggest challenges is how do we ensure
that we are staying one step ahead.
What does that look like for Red Cat?
- Well, again, I think it's constant iteration.
I mean, one thing that we've learned from Ukraine
is this idea of urgent need driving innovation
to get it out,
you know, something that's built in a garage
and try to get it fielded that day, right?
So this idea of how fast
can we get things to the battlefield?
I think in the United States, at least,
I think we're looking at the industry
of recently with, you know, Secretary of Defense
and a lot of initiatives that they're now, you know,
employing in the United States
of how can we get this technology
in the hands of the war fighter as soon as possible?
How do we eliminate some of the red tape that it takes?
You know, the idea of these long extended programs of record
that happened in the past
that are five to eight years, those are going away, right?
Now, we're seeing this idea
of this iterations happening within a two-year period
where they're recompeting every two years.
That keeps the technology from being stale.
But that also helps and drives our companies like us
to constantly be innovating
so that we can get the latest and greatest technology.
So one of the things,
the initiatives that we started at Red Cat
was called the Red Cat Futures Initiative
that we started last year.
And it's basically an industry consortium where, you know,
we know what we do best, the drone,
but all these other layers of tech stack
when it comes to AI.
And like I said, 3D mapping and aided target recognition,
leave that to other companies, right?
Let's work with and partner with best-in-breed companies
to bring that technology and accelerate it forward,
and again, to get it in the hands
of the war fighters sooner or later.
They can be innovating and iterating on their end.
We can be innovating, iterating on the drone,
and we're all marching forward together,
and it just makes it a really faster solution.
(air whooshing)
- [Host] Well, that's all we have time for
in this episode.
Thanks for joining us, and we'll see you next week.
(upbeat music)